3S-GE/GTE mix and match?

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Voivod
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Re: 3S-GE/GTE mix and match?

Post by Voivod »

Ok I know what you mean now..it would be interesting to know what bolts people were using when that area get cracked. Mostly I've seen were ARP studs.


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Re: 3S-GE/GTE mix and match?

Post by SonicSW20 »

This weakness generally only reveals itself at higher power levels, above where stock bolts become a limitation.

Still, if Toyota bothered to address this issue so late in the engines development, they must have considered it a potential issue at lower power levels too.
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Re: 3S-GE/GTE mix and match?

Post by Voivod »

SonicSW20 wrote: 26/02/21 10:00 This weakness generally only reveals itself at higher power levels, above where stock bolts become a limitation.

Still, if Toyota bothered to address this issue so late in the engines development, they must have considered it a potential issue at lower power levels too.
What do you mean? when the stock bolts becomes limitation if anyone ever try the limit on them ? It wasn't the issue for Toyota anyway..let's called it's a coincidence in the block design. Same can be said about stock conrods..but try to break them. Also 3sfe was well know to throw a rod due to conrod bolts and it wasn't recognized as issue by Toyota at the beginning.
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Re: 3S-GE/GTE mix and match?

Post by SonicSW20 »

Voivod wrote: 02/03/21 22:33 What do you mean? when the stock bolts becomes limitation if anyone ever try the limit on them ? It wasn't the issue for Toyota anyway..let's called it's a coincidence in the block design. Same can be said about stock conrods..but try to break them. Also 3sfe was well know to throw a rod due to conrod bolts and it wasn't recognized as issue by Toyota at the beginning.
Coincidence? You're going to need to explain how a change to block design can be waved away as coincidence.

Why would Toyota spend money on R&D on a block revision and the additional costs of producing new tooling etc if they didn't think the revision was necessary?
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Re: 3S-GE/GTE mix and match?

Post by Voivod »

SonicSW20 wrote: 03/03/21 9:44
Voivod wrote: 02/03/21 22:33 What do you mean? when the stock bolts becomes limitation if anyone ever try the limit on them ? It wasn't the issue for Toyota anyway..let's called it's a coincidence in the block design. Same can be said about stock conrods..but try to break them. Also 3sfe was well know to throw a rod due to conrod bolts and it wasn't recognized as issue by Toyota at the beginning.
Coincidence? You're going to need to explain how a change to block design can be waved away as coincidence.

Why would Toyota spend money on R&D on a block revision and the additional costs of producing new tooling etc if they didn't think the revision was necessary?
Because,they didn't changed the engine block design for that particular reason and especially only for 3sge which has low power level.I mean 9 year after? You don't need new tooling for it as it's the same blocks,just a different casting..
Now regarding weak block and crack around water pump area is more likely caused by APR head studs,especially when people tighten them up with allen key and the stud dig in in to the block plus higher clamping force which caused stress on that part of the block and which was never designed for it.That's how I understand that.
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Re: 3S-GE/GTE mix and match?

Post by SonicSW20 »

Voivod wrote: 03/03/21 11:33 Because,they didn't changed the engine block design for that particular reason and especially only for 3sge which has low power level.I mean 9 year after? You don't need new tooling for it as it's the same blocks,just a different casting..
Now regarding weak block and crack around water pump area is more likely caused by APR head studs,especially when people tighten them up with allen key and the stud dig in in to the block plus higher clamping force which caused stress on that part of the block and which was never designed for it.That's how I understand that.

The revised block was not only for the 3SGE, it was also for the 3SGTE. You just don't see as many of those because the 3SGE is much more common, especially in the UK. The same change also appears on the 5S block too.

You realise that the 3SGE and 3SGTE blocks are identical, with the only notable difference being the GTE has the oil feed for the turbo? In fact, on the 3SGE block you can see the location where the oil feed would be, its just not been drilled out.

Why did they change the design on that corner of the block then? No manufacturer, especially one that leads the industry on manufacturing efficiency is going to make a change to an engine block like that for no reason at all.
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Re: 3S-GE/GTE mix and match?

Post by Voivod »

SonicSW20 wrote: 03/03/21 12:53
Voivod wrote: 03/03/21 11:33 Because,they didn't changed the engine block design for that particular reason and especially only for 3sge which has low power level.I mean 9 year after? You don't need new tooling for it as it's the same blocks,just a different casting..
Now regarding weak block and crack around water pump area is more likely caused by APR head studs,especially when people tighten them up with allen key and the stud dig in in to the block plus higher clamping force which caused stress on that part of the block and which was never designed for it.That's how I understand that.

You realise that the 3SGE and 3SGTE blocks are identical, with the only notable difference being the GTE has the oil feed for the turbo? In fact, on the 3SGE block you can see the location where the oil feed would be, its just not been drilled out.
Yeah I do..in fact they are all 3s family as stamped on the block :laughing I'll bet you can fit the rev3 style sump on 3sfe same as on 5s as pictured. Also 3sge not all the same..some have oil squirters some don't..they just not machined but you can correct that. :th:
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